Ava I totally understand where you are coming from. I think it all just depends on what a person wants to do that makes the difference. My brother for instance works as an accountant for Shell Oil. He wouldn't be where he is today in his career making over $100K a year if he didn't have his college education.
Sorry Ava. There are companies that will promote without degrees (even hire without them). My husband's company wanted a person with a degree...but he was forthright and honest and told them up front he did not have one. He was not a manager when they hired him, but said that he would be. He now has 3 reports, and is a manager of his department. So it CAN happen, and they DO exist! Hoping your hubby finds one who will! Street smarts are sometimes just more valuable than the stinking piece of paper.
I think it is great to promote without a degree. I think it is silly to promote someone who has just applied with a BA and not someone who has been with the company for 10 years or more. My dh thinks it is silly also. However, he likes his job and his company. Since it was a goal to complete his degree anyway, this just gives me more motivation. He works for FED EX and it is a great company to work for. I think he perfers to stay there as long as possible...just not in the same position. lol. However, his company is VERY by the book so he won't get past operations manager without a BA. Stupid how there are so many smart and talanted people who are stuck because of not having a degree. I appreciate the work that goes into getting one but it still is silly in the long run.
I think thats what I am thinking abotu too, that I want the options there, if they want to take them.. I dont want them to be looked down upon.. ds16 already feels he is less of a person than his peers for whatever reason we have not fostered that I can see... he was naieve when we started him in high school and was teased a lot for that, and pushed around.. I almost pulled him for that, but decided the academics were worth a little toughening up, and I taught him how to handle the turkeys at school... now he is concerned cause he has a friend who is emotional ( girl who is a friend only) and he never knows if she is mad at him or not... he is a sensitive guy doesnt like to make peoples mad at him one minute though and could care less what people think the next so I figure he is well rounded!
I personally don't think college is for everyone. I will be encouraging my children to do whatever the Lord leads them to do. I went straight into the mission field after graduating from homeschool highschool, where I met my husband. I have taken a few bible college courses here and there. 2 of my siblings attended and graduated bible college, and 3 of them have taken college classes pertaining to their careers. One sister is going to college and hoping to get into a nursing program.
Options are my main concern. I would rather my dd have her degree and never use it than to end up in need of a decent paying job and by not having a degree cannot find one. I am not saying my kids need to have a 4 year degree...there are 2 year degrees. I just want them to have options. There are so many jobs that require a BA in any field. Besides, college is a fun time. So basically, I am raising my kids to attend college. However, if they were to choose not to I will not make them feel like a failure or less of a person. My brother does not have his degree and he does pretty well...but again...not as well as if he had one. Yet, he is doing well. I know another guy who is doing awesome in his field and did not finish a degree. So, a degree may not be essential but it may very well make life easier and open more doors. I may not agree with that but sometimes we have to be realistic about the world we live in.
Can't argue with that! If my child feels led into something that does not require college or whatever, I will not question the will of God in their life.
here here! I agree with that last statement too. I want them to have options, now I personally am a stay at home mom, but I don't really wish that on my dd, and I know there will be years before she is married and mom and all and I want her to be able to support herself should she end up single for a while after high school. ( which she better be! HA!) I don't want her sitting at home at 40 something wondering what she will do when shes done schooling her kids... I don't even care about the empty nest thing, I just wonder if I have enough knowledge to get a job if nessacary too... thats why I need my kids to have some sort of after high school education training etc. I just figured it out haha,
You know, I heard something once, I think maybe on Focus on the Family, they were talking about how older women made much better employees than those fresh out of college. If they have raised children and managed a home they had learned a lot of life skills along the way that made them very valuable to employers. They also said that women in the position of going back to work after raising children should put their skills on their resumes rather than their employment history.
I do hope that Ems goes to college. Mainly for the reasons Ava listed. I like the idea of her having options. If she doesn't go, then this is alright too. I know many people who went to college but are not using their degree for what they intended it to be used for. BUT, this degree has allowed them to get other jobs they wouldn't have received without it. I also know people who are very successful without college. I do know that in California it is more difficult to get a quality job without a degree, although not impossible. I honestly do not see it happening around here much. When Ems grows up she wants to be a veterinarian and a ballet dancer.
The bottom line for me is that I want my children to be happy well rounded individuals. I want my kids to be happy with what they end up doing in life no matter what that is. If they want to go to college or need to because of what the want to ultimately do in life then I will support them and help them all I can. If they do not want or need to go I will support them as well. If one daughter wants to be a doctor - great! If the other wants to be a stay at home mom and wife I think that is just as fantastic. I personally love staying home. I am extremely fullfilled with what I do and I could not imagine giving this up to go work in an office or something. But that is me. I will always support my kids in whatever life path they chose whether or not it includes going to college.
You guys are really great for stress relief! Thanks all of you! I was thinking on the fact that I totally love staying at home too, today. While I was talking with a hsmom about another possible co op starting up I was wondering if I want to join it or not. I like the connections but don't really find that I have the time, between teaching the kids here at home to running to sports or other classes I am either online , writing, workin with one Ministry or another, or cleaning house... I kinda think I like it this way for the most part. Only once in a while I think.. what if I ahd kept working? What kind of an education could my kids have gotten then? Can they really be all that they want to be? that kind of thing gets to me now and then.. but on a day like today, I reall am glad I am a stay at home mom, even if I did not teach my own kids, I probably would have ended up at home waiting for them to return.
I am the only person on my side of the family who has graduated from college. Many of them are very successful at what they are doing now, with no college degree. Some aren't. but that's more a thing of choices they made and things that happened because of those choices! I also will support my children whichever direction they head, well, as long as it's a Godly direction, whatever it may be! College or no college. My goals for when I grew up were to go to Africa as a missionary, get married and have and raise kids! College wasn't even in my scope of things. I'm not sure about my brother....he didn't ever like school much. My sister was going to go to college and be a PE teacher or something like that. She would've been a good one too! But life happens sometimes. She got married, I went to college. But eventually, all my dreams were and are being fulfiilled! I'm also very content to be exactly where I am! What do my kids want to be? At this moment, this is where they stand: ds16--professional soccer player (not possible!) or something in computers. ds14--pastor or chef dd11--chemist (when she was 4-7 or so she wanted to be "A McDonald's Worker" so she's come a ways since then! However, who knows? She may get that wish! :lol: )
I'm coming into this conversation kinda late, but I do have a thought to add. God has a unique plan for each of our children's lives, and I believe the major part of our job as parents is to help them develop their potential in order for them to follow His call on their lives. That might include college, or entrepreneurship, apprenticeship, business ownership, or homemaking--whatever place uses their gifts to the maximum for the Lord's kingdom. So, our goal in training them well and keeping options open might include nice houses, a good-paying job, etc., but those are merely by-products toward the true goal of being effective servants of the King wherever they are. I think that that is assumed in this discussion, but I wanted to define it a little more clearly, anyway. Knowing that our children already have the potential to fulfill God's call on their lives, whatever it is, gives me a measure of peace. I merely help develop their potential to serve Him, keep options open, and then let God and each child work out the details. So, yep, it might include college. Might not. Ds (17) has his own antique car business, buying and selling, operating under a licensed car dealer in town. 'Does his own negotiating, going to the courthouse for titles, etc. I'd be surprised if he chooses to give up his business for college. He might though.
AMEN! Exactly! I would be surprised if you son gave up his business to go to college also. I know I wouldn't if I were him. lol. Guess, I need not be so narrow in what I consider where options come from. Allow God to be the deciding factor.
I would encourage all you to check out the book The Millionaire Mind. The author studied the top of the top wage earners in America (something like the top .1 %). A large number of them do not have college degrees, I some what remeber something about them even being like "c" average kids in High school. But the trait that they ALL had in common was integrity that was above reproach, and were frugal with their money. My dh doesn't have a degree and we are doing great, we are going to jump ship and become self employeed later this year (if the Lord is still Willing!) We are debt free, but the house and that will be paid off shortly as well. We have a chunk of money in retirment and are well on our way to be "upper class" wage earners as we grow older. We also have a way above average net worth then those in our age bracket. I have a degree, and have never used it. I think it was a waste of money, because the classes were a joke. I even made the deans list. I was great at taking test but I don't think I learned a bit of knowledge to use in the real world. There is no way I would have been able to work a job in my field of study. There is a reason Docs have to be interns. I think that the idea where parents push kids into college or say that you have to go is delaying the careers and stiffling the creativity and drive of many young kids. We as a nation are telling our youth that they cannot amount to anything without a degree, or that they cannot succeed without one. On the flip side it is saying that they are something once they get that paper. And that just isn't true (with the excepetion of Docs, Lawyers etc) Do you wonder when college became the "thing to do." The goverment pushed the GI's returning home to get a college degree and use their GI bill to pay for college. They ran huge marketing campaigns saying that if you want to get ahead you have to go to college. That is why it is now engrained in our society, and subsidized by the goverement too. I am not against "further education" I don't think learning stops at the end of High School. I try to read at least one non fiction book a month (usually more) I have taken one or two day classes to learn to do something I needed or was intrested in. Learning doesn't happen in a classroom with 150+ of your closest friends, good test taking skill do!! Which was the size of most of the basic classes in a public college. How many times have we had post on here about using "real" books to teach things, and talked about how learning in real life, and about things that intrest us is the best way to learn. Why does that change once you graduate high school? Do you really think it does? If it doesn't then what is the point of a college degree (again with the exceptions as mentioned above) Are we not wanting to send our kids to college for an "education?" If it is for the "other education" like 90% of Christian kids loose their faith in college. What about the large number of abortions acredited to girls in college .http://www.studentsforlife.org/index.php/pro-lifejobs/fieldagent/ How many kids there die of binge drinking, drug overdoses or have addicitons started there etc. These are the same kids who we (me personally here) did not want our kids going to PS with, just with less adult supervison. There is also the financial part of it as well. Yes people with college degrees supossidly make more money. Right? This artical says that it is true but only a 10% increase (the total over a lifetime) IF you make above the median income level with good raises to keep you above inflation your whole working career. This factors in the cost of college, and the lost years of creating an income while attending college. If something happens and you don't, say a change in your career path, a drop in the economy, motherhood some kind of sickness or disablilty. Then it doesn't pay off. http://assetbuilder.com/blogs/scott_burns/archive/2007/09/21/does-it-pay-to-go-to-college.aspx I also would like to dispell the myth that you cannot get a good paying job without a degree (again not counting those like the docs and lawyers). There are several things that a "career coach" will tell you to do if you want to get that job of your dreams.(check out dan millers 48 days to the work you love) Most of which mean you have to take the inititive and really stand out, sell yourself to those in charge. My dh is a great example, he is now reaching the pay in his field that most people reach when they are 20+ years older then he is now. He has had no formal training in his field, he has taken it upon himself to read up and learn how to do what needs to be done, and how to do it more effeciently, to excell. Now he is going to set out and become self employeed, because he doesn't want to move up in the company..he would rather own the company!!! He has also learned the in and outs of the whole business so that he can succeed in all the areas associated with his field. And he doesn't have to pay off the student loans that those other people have to pay off. Now with all that said, my kids will have that option. They will work (either here at home or else wheres) until they graduate from High school. At which time they will have the choice to use the money we have set aside in their "college fund" to start a business, go to college, buy a house etc. I will encourage them do do what ever God is leading them to do. God willing our plans will succeed and we will have great kids who know the plans HE has for them and without a doubt they will know the direction he wants them to go. College or not!!
I don't think it matters what your parents say or do lol. My mom is a teacher with her masters. Pushed me to check out colleges ect. I even managed a full ride music scholarship to a local college back then and TURNED IT DOWN. Went to community college for 2 years instead and never did even get an AA out of it. I was a good student in hs, good kid, involved with music and sports. College just never interested me because I didn't know what i wanted to do. To this day, at 32 years old, I still don't know what I want to do. So sure, I guess you're supposed to go onto college, but that doesn't mean you do, nor does it mean your doomed. I managed to work my way up the ranks in a hospital and have a lot of experience in materials management, purchasing and inventory all of which pay quite well in the medical field if you know what you're doing. I had a boss at the 2nd hospital I worked at that they hired because he had a business degree from Yale. Didn't do him a BIT of good because he knew nothing about hospital inventory, supplies ect. We all taught him a few things and the dayshift supervisor ended up getting HIM fired and she had NO college whatsoever. I think college is important, but I'm certainly not going to sit here and say "you have to go to college as soon as you graduate" Dd wants to be a archaelogogist. She's 7. WHen I was 7 I wanted to be a lawyer. That faded by the time I was in Jr. High lol.
I think the reason I expected my kids to go to College is my husbands family all went, my family did not all go though beause we took the classes we needed to fulfill our work requirements and that was it, I have had about 4-5 years between Bible College and two different Community Colleges.. and I would have loved to continue going to college forever because I really enjoyed it, Part of my wanting them to go too is to get away from us... I wanted to go to college to get away from my family... for good reason, at the time things were haywire at home, so College and dorm rooms was a dream. MY kids on the other hand want to either stay at home or , ds wants to get an apartment with a couple buddies from church and go to local community college then transfer to a Christian University for his Bible teaching stuff... and some more of the movie making stuff he wants. Dd , she is thinking its a carreer in the fashion of homes or clothes for her cause she likes to get creative with fabric and designing styles for homes... I have a project for her to make a model home I just remembered so I best make sure she has her poster/tag board! I really appreciate all of your help and encouragement, I know I am not alone in wondering which is best for my particular kids, I think also the fact we have three "College funds" in accounts was a big push in my brain too. But Prairie mom is so right its not about what I think is best even, its what HE thinks is best for my children... I want them to seek Him for His direction in thier lives... I know ds has, thats why he has the Pastor in there in his plans. Now he is talking taking his GED this Summer and testing out to get started early with is best friend! I think that would be okay, see before this thread I would have said NO WAY< but now I can relax and have it all in perspective! God is so good!
