Something is not right, here... (Careful, strong opinions ahead....) Child accused of killing father and father's roommate. http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20241615,00.html http://www.kwtx.com/home/headlines/34758939.html http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2008/11/legal-experts-question-police.html Ok..... If the child did it... #1 He is ill and needs help. or #2 He was abused in some way. Neither of these two scenarios leads me to want "Retribution", nor do I feel the need to "Try him as an ADULT".. which is what the prosecutor wants to do! Either way, IF he did it, he NEEDS HELP! They "Interviewed" him for an hour, by himself, no relative, no lawyer, with LEADING questions, before he "Confessed". Oh, and NO Miranda rights.... :evil: Does anyone remember the HUGE,LIFE CHANGING trial of the day care children from FLorida, who were supposedly forced into (Adult) games by their day care workers.. Turns out it was NOT true and the children had been fed leading questions by sick prosecutors>>??? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McMartin_preschool_trial#Interviewing_and_examining_the_children Again, take #1 and #2 into consideration... And they want to try him as an ADULT??? Oh! And not to mention.. WHY was the video of his supposed confession RELEASED???? :evil: I smell a rat! This child doesn't even have the maturity of a 9 year old. WHY? Because, hello! He is only 8! Are these people crazy????
As if that weren't bad enough, I was looking at the comments in the last link, and someone actually posted this: Children are property of the state and have no "Miranda Rights". !!! There are some serious nuts out there.
I've read about this and have watched a news show (can't remember the name) that was discussing the investigation and the confession. Obviously for lack of all the information, I don't know whether he did it or not. That being said, I do have a huge problem with such a young child (or any one) being questioned with out proper legal advice or in the case of a child a parent being present. The police said that at first they were treating him as a victim and that is why no one else was in the room with him. As the questioning went on they began to see lies and evasive answers...........Now if this is the case, they should have stopped immediately and called the mom in and waited until a lawyer could get there. Did they really think if they stopped that they couldn't solve the crime? Think about it. What kind of criminal mastermind would this 8 year old be to get rid of all evidence? Yes, I'm sure he could have watched some crime shows or read some books, but at 8 years old how much could he understand about crime scene evidence? And why would the police risk having the confession (if they are so sure about it) thrown out by ignoring this childs rights? So I agree.........Something definetly smells funky.........
REALLY!!!! Funny since I don't even consider my children MY property. I agree Scottie, there are some serious nuts out there.
My question is...was the boy on psych drugs? There have been 25 school shootings since the 1980s and ALL of those children were on psych drugs. I just saw two videos where many children as young as 5 have committed suicide while being on psych drugs. FIVE YEARS OLD!! http://www.cchr.org/#/videos/prescription-for-violence http://www.cchr.org/#/videos/prescription And other instances where perfectly happy and normal people have shot their entire families. Could an eight-year-old have killed his father and someone else? Yes. If he was on psych drugs. I'd say watch the story and see.
8 years old isn't what an 8 year old was 10 or 15 years ago. This world is not full of innocent children anymore. Times have changed and even kids can kill without being on pysch drugs or being abused. IF this is true and he did it I think he should be tried as an adult, if not this boy will be back on the streets when he is 21 and who's to say that it won't happen again. Do I think the police messed up , YOU BET( as far as not having a parent or lawyer present). Do I think that there might be abuse , MAYBE. But kids lie also, some kids kill just because. I see and hear it every other day here in Vegas, kids as young as 10 shooting up a bus full of kids because someone called him a name. I will wait for all of the evidence to be out , not just what was released to make a judgement. I think this will be difficult and people don't want to believe a kid would just kill for no reason ( at least not one we would like to hear , like abuse or drugs) but SOMETIMES they do.
YEA@! LEt's try the 8 year old as an adult! The little manipulative B**tard should HANG!!!! (Sarcasm) Bull crap. And the scenario of the kid shooting up the school bus after being teased is a form of reaction after abuse.. meaning the child needs HELP.. not to be hung out by the system. It is a sign that WE failed him. Back to my two original points... Either his is ill and needs help, or he was abused and needs help... So if he did do it, why are they so gung-ho to hang him as if he were some monster? They let repeat drunk drivers back in the road with less fan fare...
No innocent children anymore...? You know, that child could stare me into the eyes and talk about how he not only did it but that he liked it, and I would still cry for him and say we failed him and say he needs to be locked up in a mental institution because he is "ILL".... So, I agree with you, He does NOT belong in a system that WILL crank out a mass murderer in 10 years.
I didn't say hang him, try him and place him in jail IF HE DID IT. I also didn't say there are NO INNOCENt children left , there just isn't alot left ( NOT FULL OF >>>). There is too much lack of responsability of todays youth! So he killed 2 people but its o.k if he was abused or on pysch drugs?? Put him in a mental hospital, release him in a few years and everything is okie dokie?? The child from the bus shooting.. It was a gang thing, no mental abuse of constant name calling. Rival gang, anger issues, not abuse. Did he need help , maybe but he still knew guns/bullets kill and didn't care if he shot the person in question and/or other people at the same time. People live through abuse and don't kill people or even have mental issues that would casue them to do these types of things. Some peole do, some don't, but don't go feeling too sorry for him, he still knowing killed 2 people , including his father!! Also we only seen a fraction of this interview. We also don't have knowledge of the physical evidence. So we can only make a quick judgement. I'm think I'm stepping off this one. You seem to think I don't care about this child, I do. BUT there are somethings that children do that has nothing to do with abuse or mental issue and people have to explain to themselves that children just don't do this so they find an answer that suits them. If he did this he should pay the price. If the drunk driver killed someone he does pay
I heard about this and my heart sank seeing as I have an 8 year old boy as well. What made me mad is that I saw some of the footage of the "confession". They should have had a lawyer or some sort of adult in there with the child. I also thought the questions and the way they worded them to the child made him answer a certain way. I thought that was horrid.
I'm so conflicted about this case. He is 8 years old! In my book that is still practically a baby. 8 year olds should not be tried as adults. Even if he did it, he needs HELP! This child may have severe mental issues which need to be addresses immediately. Whether he did it or witnessed it, he is going to be messed up for a long time. That being said, he killed his father! How can we ever be sure that in 10 years he won't be back on the streets to do it all again? This is a delicate situation, I hope it is handled carefully and with understanding. I'll definitely be watching this case.
I have an 8 year old boy. He understands that killing is wrong. He also understand that if he shoots a gun at someone he could kill that person. He even understands the concept of death. However, he forgets on a weekly basis to empty the trash cans. He can be asked to go upstairs to get his shoes and forget what he was just asked by the time he gets up there. He doesn't see that picking with his 3 year old sister will only cause her to pick with him in the end. He also thinks is a good idea to attach a wagon to a bike and sit the wagon while a person on the bike rides a million miles an hour. My 8 year old still dreams of being the star football player when he plays football outside. He plays legos and with GI Joes. He cries when he is hurt. He is not allowed to be home alone. He is not allowed to use the stove. He needs an adult to guide him and teach him. An eight year old no matter the circumstances is NOT an adult. Eight year olds are not trusted to make medical decisions or educational decisions. Heck, my eight year old isn't even allowed to choose how much ice cream he is allowed to eat at one sitting. Yes, in this today's society an eight year old does not fit the wide eyed, innocent, still playing cops and robbers in the backyard 8 year old of years past. However, the mind of an 8 year old did not evolve or mature over time he still maintains an 8 year old brain the same of the children of years past. So, an 8 year old mind is assulted in today's world by images of violence and sex. He is forced to reconcile images and experiences in his mind that an 8 year old of years past couldn't even imagine. We are fools to think these things do not have great impact on a child. I am not a bleeding heart liberal. I am not saying we can always blame others or media for our actions. I am not saying a minor should never be tried as an adult. I am saying that an 8 year old maintains an 8 year old mind regardless of his actions. We are not speaking of the fine line between a 17 and 18 year old. If the state is not required to read miranda rights to this child then it is already admitted he is a child and not an adult. If this child was not given every right an adult would have during this investigation then it is again admitted he is not an adult. I think this child needs help. I also think this child needs to be punished. I just don't think locking him up and throwing away the key is the right option.
I agree with Ava. An 8 year old is not mature enough to fully grasp the concept of death. An 8 year old is not emotionally prepared to make long-term decisions, or to fully recognize the results of those decisions. I have a 7 1/2 year old. My grandmother died last year, and she shrugged and went back to playing after we told her. THREE MONTHS later, she woke up in the middle of the night crying because she realized she would never see Memaw again. It takes young children awhile to process. That said, I don't think he should be taught that there are no consequences. I don't think the police should interrogate him without someone else. I can't imagine, as his mom, not DEMANDING to sit in with him or wait for a lawyer. (Which is not to fault the mom, I'm sure she was concerned with him.) If he did not shoot them - which I'm sure is what the mom thought beforehand - but just found the body, he has to be traumatized; to go through a police questioning procedure has to be emotionally difficult for anyone at that stage.
Why does treating an apparent mental problem get equated by so many with "Getting away with it"? And no drunk drivers do NOT always get punished when they kill someone... Ask me how I know. Ask me how many crosses I have had to erect because the state doesn't even enforce the judges ruling that the drunk POS has to erect the cross? Much less ACTUALLY spend any time in Jail! I joined MADD in 1986 WAAAY back in the day... Drunk drivers are a joke, maybe not as much as they used to be, but people, in general STILL give them MUCH more leeway in the BLAME game to the ends (The death of someone) than they do for when an CHILD kills... That is just so backwards. Drunk drivers get away with murder all the time, maybe not every time, but all I have to do to kill you is have a few beers, claim drunkenness, and get out in 9 months. DONE. Sentence will vary depending on what state I am in and the county judge (Does he have a few after work, too???) Whereas, many here would (Hang is a euphemism for "Throw away the key") Try this CHILD as an ADULT? I just don't get it. I remember the travesty of justice in what happened to a young boy a few years back. He was 12 and acting out wrestling moves he saw on tv.. He drop kicked a little girl in his house. She died. They convicted him of murder AS AN ADULT... They ruined his life, moreso that being responsible for the death of someone already ruined it. They wanted to KILL him... DEATH penalty for a 12 year old, who simply forgot himself for a moment. It brings to mind the "No tolerance" BS so prominent in school systems now. Something was going on in that house that drove that boy to kill, IF he did.... And this is no different that battered wives.... To which people give more leeway to as well... Sad.
Because so many want vengence and not a solution. As far as drunk driving....I think if someone dies then it is murder. Sorry but I think a drunk driver should be locked up. The person knew he was going to drink before he decided to drive that night. Drunk driving is no accident and there are no excuses. I don't think anyone should be given a ligher sentence becuase of drugs or alcohol. I would make an exception for a doctor prescribed med...but that's another story and not relevant. I remember seeing that on tv. Even the mom of the girl that died didn't want to see him put to death. I don't agree with a 12 year old getting the death penalty. However, I do think the kid needed to be punished. The problem was he should not have been treated as an adult as he clearly was not. He should have shown better judgement and should have know better at his age. So, a little juvie hall would have been enough in my mind. I agree something had to prompt this act as all acts of violence are prompted by something either seen or unseen. I have seen battered women on tv who did serve jail time for killing their husbands. However you statement begs the question "when should leeway apply to murder?" Is it ok to kill because you are being abused? To what extent do we have to be abused in order to get away with murder? So many questions and no real answers. I just hope justice will be served in this case...the one with the 8 year old. Funny...what would be just? He needs to take responsibility and he needs help. he needs a solution not simply blind punishment.
Jen, just wanted to throw out that I don't, per se, necessarily think that "learning their are consequences" is equal to "not getting away with it." (I didn't see you as targeting me, FYI, just wanted to respond. Now if you disagree, please let me know.) IMO, whether the cause was age, abuse, medication, or a mental disorder, there still need to be consequences, but those are to a different degree depending on the problem. If for no other reason than that he needs to learn that abuse does not require retribution but due process. Now, in that scenario, that does not mean that the child should be tossed into jail as a means of learning consequences. It may be that a counselor determines the child is carrying a severe load of guilt and finds a way that is best for this child. However, there is also the danger that an intentionally malicious teen might determine that he "got away with it" and copy him, which I think is a big part of what scares people. Of course, the death penalty doesn't actually keep people from committing murder, etc, so that should be balanced in. I think the press owes the community the responsibility of emphasizing that the child understands the consequences, if only to deter others, IF he is found guilty. But I also don't think that the ends justifies the means; that police officers should be so intent on solving a crime that they commit one; or that an intimidated 8 year should be counted as reliable. Poor kid. If he truly his guilty, I feel for him; and if he is innocent, I feel doubly. SG
There is just so much we do not know. I agree that 8 yrs old is young, but there is some children out there that are "ILL". Yet that still doesn't give anyone the right to kill, ill or not. Now here is something for you to think about. It is kind of like this. When dh was younger he spent a lot of time in boys homes, juvy, jail and such. Well in the boys home there was a boy there with him. He killed someone at the age of 9. He killed this person for telling him to please shut up his dog. This kid went into his home got a shot gun went out side and blew this guys head off. Well they tried him as a child not an adult. So, this means he was out at the age of 19 and no one would ever know he killed. Well by the time dh met him he was 15 or 16 and still had no remorse for what he had done, and knew he would be out and free in a few years. So, when you think about it, we will never know if he is one of those kids that will get better. Or if we will end up with a "monster" on the streets with the I got away with it once attitude.
No offense, Jen, but if he had killed your little girl doing wrestling moves I bet you wouldn't simply say he 'forgot himself'. When that case happened, I wondered to myself what I'd do if it involved my kids. My son likes wrestling, and always has. If he were 12 and pulled that move on his little sister, I'd probably have handed him over myself. 12 years old is old enough to know better than to do such a crazy thing.
