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Old 03-15-2006, 10:37 AM
callowminx callowminx is offline
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Homeschooling is wrong.

Let's face it, homeschooling is wrong. Homeschooling for religous reasons is especialy wrong. For the most part from what I've read, it seems that parents that homeschool openly say that they do it to shelter or protect their children. They also claim there are many advantages to homeschooling. But are these really good for your children in the long run? Does it really make them better people?

Some of the main reasons people homeschool their kids are they dont think that public schools offer a good enough education. But can a parent accually offer a better one? In most states a parent only has to have a high school diploma to teach their children. In conventional schools each teacher is specially trained to teach the subjects they teach. Even a parent with a college degree is really only educated in one subject. This limits what the children can learn.

In a traditional classroom a child will ingage in group projects, class discussions and learn from other peers. This is an important part of learning that a homeschooled kid would not participate in. A child needs to learn how to work with others. (Activities like sports and other groups don't provide actually working intellectually with others) In a class room children also learn about different ethnicities, cultures and lifestyles. Some may be good or bad but then at least they know and maybe appreciate their lives more unlike a homeschooled child that would only know their own life.

Being in a classroom with a teacher also teaches the child repect for the person in charge. Not just a parent. This is a quality that would be used in life such as having a job and dealing with a boss or in college. Also it is natural for a child to rebel from their parents. How is a child going to learn if he or she doesn't want to listen to you?

When people homeschool because of religous reasons it prevents the children from learning about different religons and results in either ignorance or closemindedness. The only reason parents do this, from what i've read is that they want to instill their values and beliefs in their child. Is this fair to the child? To only know what their parents want them to know isn't fair. A major benifit in the country is that we can practice whatever religion we want. Children have that right too. Why wouldn't a person want to let their kids see other religous views? This doesn't prepare them for the real world when they leave the home.

I was homeschool for a while when I was in highschool. I only had to have sixteen credits to graduate. Now does that sound like a good education? No, it doesn't and it did not prepare me for college. Being homeschooled is very lonely. I don't understand why parents are so set on putting their children though this. Their are thousands of websites made by homeschooling parents defending their lifestyles. There are not many sites about how homeschooling is wrong. If this is the case why are parents to determined to defend their lifestyle? Maybe it's because when they think about it they know it's wrong. A parent should not be allowed to control ever aspect of a child's life, especcially what and how they learn.

Old 03-15-2006, 11:02 AM
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ABall ABall is offline
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I am so sorry that you had a bad homeschool experience. I don't think that your homeschooling experience qualifies you to understand why so many of us homeshcool. Were you part of your town's homeschool community? In my town we get together and have meetings with the other parents, the kids play. We have a P. E. group, we have field trips, and organize trips to plays, next week we are putting on a play, a parade to show off the costumes and a potluck. Other groups are more structured where parents actlivly teach subjects theat they know about and there are "classes" with homework. Your article against homeschooling will be offensive to most of the people here, however you are entitled to share your opinion any time.
I don't know what you are looking for as far as a response, I am sure others will let you know that their kids are doing very well, not loosing out on any social activities. And will represent their generation with intelegence and confidence and for the most part you may or may not even know that they have been homeschooled, therefore your opinion is just that and has no merrit for fact.
Old 03-15-2006, 01:49 PM
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She She is offline
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So sorry to hear that your past was not as wonderful as you would have liked.

I wonder why you register for a homeschooling website forum if all you needed to do was vent a bit and bash some people for their choices.

Religious, academic, drug using parents who can't get the kids to school, whatever the reason....those have to be decided on an individual basis. No one put any of us in charge to decide the way others live their lives.

Please don't continue to use this as your venting space. We all love what we do and enjoy what we do!
Happy Schooling!

Old 03-15-2006, 02:26 PM
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Syele Syele is offline
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I wrote another response for you, but the forum seems to have eaten it!

I did lots of research before making my decision to Homeschool my daughter and I talked to a great many homeschoolers and read lots of studies. There are some bad situations out there, parents who mean well but don't succeed at it. These parents who don't prepare their children for college or to be productive members of society are a minority. Public schools certainly doesn't have a better overall track record. You can cite the teachers degrees if you like, but that is not fail proof.* No one form of schooling is perfect for all children. In all my studying on homeschooling the vast majority of them were doing BETTER in college then their public schooled peers. Many Students of public schools arrive at college unprepared too. Regardless of form of schooling there are always going to be students who just didn't work hard enough to be prepared for college. You only needed 16 credits. Did you go research what standards you'd need to know to do well in college? Did you study anything on your own ... without being forced, graded or offered a credit for it? Did you want to go to college and make sure you were prepared for it? Did you just assume your parents are perfect gods from heaven that would never accidentally leave anything out? Have you taken any responsibility for your own learning at all? Or is it all the fault of those who tried to teach you something? I would ask the same questions of a Public High school student complaining they weren't prepared for college. Curriculum, credits, teaching sessions, classes, grades, textbooks... they are all a means to an end. That end is to help you learn... if you didn't take all the opportunities given then it's only yourself you have to blame. If you took every opportunity to learn given to you, studied hard and you still were not prepared for college then you are a minority and if you research it a bit, you will see that. If that's the case I'm sorry your experience was so bad.

As for groups not being adequate.. We are in a homeschool group, we go to field trips, do group projects and have play time together for the kids. We plan for next year (All our kids are currently in pre-k to 1st grade level) to start some co-op style classes, a science fair, speeches for the kids to give in front of the group (20 kids and 25 adults will be there), a book club for discussions on what they read. What sort of "working intellectually with others" did you mean? In public school I remember a speech or two a year, 3 science fairs I was allowed to be in and no "intellectual" discussions until highschool. Even then I got thrown out of Biology class permanently because I asked a question about a scientific journal article about the archaeopteryx that was different than the information in my textbook. In English lit. class I was asked not to talk in class anymore because the things I was discussing about the literature we read were "too advanced" for the rest of the class. If asking questions like that are enough to be thrown out or asked to not talk anymore.. I hardly believe there are many intellectual discussions going on.

Public Schools do NOT teach religious diversity and often include inaccurate information even when not related to religion. I haven't been able to locate any religious groups claiming that the public schools accurately portray anything about their religion. The Pilgrims are not even taught accurately.** New Jersey Department of Education has removed all the references to the Pilgrims and the Mayflower from its history standard for school textbooks. There is at least one text book for science used in public schools that teaches that the equator goes through the United States. Don't even get me started on "fuzzy math" that my school district is currently using! You asked if it's fair to teach only one religion at home. Tell me, is it fair to teach children lots of untruths and half-truths at public schools? "A nation which does not remember what it was yesterday, does not know what it is today, nor what it is trying to do. We are trying to do a futile thing if we do not know where we came from or what we have been about." (Woodrow Wilson).

Teaching from accurate textbooks or better yet the actual books that the textbooks quote because they are too long to cover in a public school setting will make a difference in itself. Parents can teach a child that learning is a lifelong process not, something you do to get grades only. This will create people who continue to learn regardless of circumstances and that will improve society. Parents also know their children well and can tailor the learning environment to best fit learning styles. Public school cannot do that. My daughter is WAY above her age level in reading and writing but average on math. In public school she'd either be board silly in reading and writing or she'd be struggling to survive in math and dealing with peers older than she is. At home she can do everything on the level she is at already. I have had two public school teachers tell me to take her books away and not let her read anything above her age level and not allow her to practice handwriting yet.. so that school would be easier for her!

Perhaps the reason you can't find many sites against homeschooling is that there are good reasons to homeschool. You are entitled to your opinion but I don't think posting your crusade here where people have done their research, suffered with children with disabilities or gifted children the public school can't accommodate, have children who don't learn well in the school type environment, live in school districts that have the worst curriculum in the country, and/or have other reasons to homeschool that are very compelling is going to change our opinion. So what is your purpose in posting this here?

*My fourth grade teacher was mentally insane (I can verify this by adults who were present, not just ravings of 4th graders) and my fifth grade teacher Was a K teacher who got moved to 5th against her will and her training... It was not pretty. Due to the teacher shortage many teachers are people with regular degrees and then get a certification to teach based on testing only, I don't think these teachers are any worse at their job for it. Long term subs often don't even have to have a college degree... and I've seen long term subs cover a class for months at a time. every state has diffrent rules and diffrent standards for public school teachers.

**"One book had thirty pages on the Pilgrims, including the first Thanksgiving. But there was not a single reference to religion, even as part of the Pilgrims' lives. Another textbook described the Pilgrims simply as 'people who make long trips.' Another said that after their first year, the Pilgrims 'wanted to give thanks for all they had,' omitting they were thankful to God. Dr. Vitz said, 'It is common in these books to treat Thanksgiving without explaining to whom the Pilgrims gave thanks . . . The Pueblo [Indians] can pray to Mother Earth, but Pilgrims can't be described as praying to God -- and never are Christians described as praying to Jesus . . . .'" Wouldn't you say lying about what religion is would be bad for children?
Old 03-15-2006, 02:48 PM
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becky becky is offline
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Okay.. who left the gate open?
So you think homeschooling is wrong, callowminx? I bet if you were properly homeschooled you'd spell better...

I think your post is genuine because you didn't get personal, but you do need to hang out awhile and see how it is here. No one wants to isolate their kids and as a matter of fact I have most of the concerns for my child that you bring up.
Old 03-15-2006, 03:13 PM
Northwriter Northwriter is offline
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I don't know if "callowminx" jumped in here to stir the pot or to voice genuine concerns. I'll not attempt to judge motives.

I do know that his or her arguments ring hollow. Many opinions are offered; none of them are backed up by facts. If someone wants to write a creditable refutation of the value of homeschooling, he or she should take the time to do some research and bring forth a few established facts.

As the essay stands, many objections are stated based on personal opinions about the results of homeschooling. Although some people may agree with these opinions, others may have scads of evidence to the contrary.

As a general rule, people who have committed to homeschooling are not going to be swayed by the opinions of an essayist who lacks basic rhetorical skills and can't piece together an even semi-logical argument.
Old 03-15-2006, 04:22 PM
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Ava Rose Ava Rose is offline
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Becky, you said what I was thinking about the chick's spelling.

The bottem line is why did callowmix post? Also, if callowmix is so openminded then why shut your mind to homeschooling? How can you intelligently make a general statement that homeschooling is wrong? You can have whatever view you want...but last I checked this is America. Home of freedom, and that includes religious freedom. I am sorry something has made you so mad as to lash out on us. Maybe you should try working that out first....ya think?
Old 03-15-2006, 05:23 PM
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Deena Deena is offline
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God gave us our children to raise and learn. Why are we okay to teach and raise them when they're younger, but suddenly when they turn 5 or 6 parents are no longer good enough? Total strangers teaching my child to fit into a preset mold set by the government does not interest me!

My children have learned manners and interrelational skills, relating to many people, adults and children alike(not just peers the same age, as in ps) very well.

My children are ALWAYS in the 90% range when taking the ITBS test each year, and I test them 1 grade level above their ps peers! So even though I am just a lowly parent, I must be doing SOMEthing right! That also means they test better than the majority of the kids that go to these wonderful schools you're talking about!

I believe God gave me the command to raise my children for the right, not allow others to "indoctrinate" them with false stories and not even allow God to be mentioned without getting in trouble! Is that not being close-minded?! It is NOT natural for a child to rebel against parents! Because of worldly influences, they often do, but when God created man, he did not put in anything that makes it natural for them to rebel, it's a myth that a teenager must rebel! I know many who have not. I have a 14-yr. old who has not shown a sign of rebellion. He could make that choice, but if it was natural, it would have started showing up by now!

Yes, there are MANY advantages to homeschooling, and yes, they ARE worth it! My kids don't need to be inundated with drugs, alcohol, pregnancy, bad attitudes, and peer pressure. Why should that be something they need to have? They know about it, we've talked about it, and we've come to the conclusion that we don't need that kind of thing. Having them learn Godly values is important. They learn them well, and when they are outside of our homeschooling when they do things with friends, or when they go out and get jobs, or when they go to college, they have those values learned well, and can stand up for what they believe in. They realize that choices are important and they also realize that what God wants them to do is infinitely more important than what peers want them to do. THAT is NOT learned in ps!!!

About being lonely---you can make it what you want. We had plenty of opportunity to interact socially and intellectualy with others. So much so, in fact, that my kids asked if we could let something go and just be home together. So we do limited things and learn that you can be bored and lonely if you choose, or you can keep yourself busy with intellectual pursuits. Volunteering and helping others is a great form of learning that gets you out with others, interacting in a VERY important way, as Jesus Himself did!

Who knows their children best--teachers or parents? Hopefully the answer would be parents! Yet, when off at school and other activities that often isn't the case. Families were made to spend time with, not run away from by going other places and to other things. So time spent together as a family is very important.

Oh my, I could go on and on about the positive aspects of homeschooling! My question to you would be, "Why did you feel you needed to post this here and defend your position and lifestyle? Probably because when you really think about it, you know you're wrong! (See the end of your post. This is my rebuttal to your comment. Makes just as much sense as yours does, huh?!)
Blessings, Deena

"Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you. Not as the world gives, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled or afraid." John 14:27

I love GOD, my dh , ds18 , ds15 and dd12 with ALL my heart!

"Prayer is baring your soul to the One who loved you before you even knew of Him and letting Him speak to your heart." ---Storie Omartian---

I feel blessed to be on year 12 of Homeschooling!
Old 03-15-2006, 09:52 PM
Brenda Brenda is offline
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I wonder what kind of education Albert Einstein's mother had? I wonder if she had a degree in education? Hmmm... what ever she had for an education, I'd say she did a good job at it.

I wonder what a homeschooled child is missing out on by not being exposed to the public school (and I CAN speak this from experience)... bullying, foul mouths, labels, poor environment and I could go on for a long time on this one...

(SARCASM being used here) You know... those homeschooled children (and their parents) really need to get a life!!! Shame on you for staying in your house 24/7 - for never going out in public, for never allowing them to play with other children, for sheltering them, for neglecting them (by not exposing them to profanity at such a young age)!

Originally Posted by callowminx
Why wouldn't a person want to let their kids see other religous views? This doesn't prepare them for the real world when they leave the home.
Because their is only One God... I serve that One God and I will not knowingly allow my child to serve a false god, worshipping other idols and ending up headed straight to the pitts of hell.

I'm sorry that you've had an appearently miserable homeschool experience... not all homeschool experiences are like that. As a parent, I am responsible for protecting my children, for making decisions that affect their well being... if that means pulling them from public school (again) to bring them home, tp provide a loving environment and provide the education that they need, that's a decision I am making and quite honestly not open to anyone else for debate.

You obviously have internet access... here's a suggestion, before your retort to posting on a topic you clearly don't have a lot of knowledge about, you really should do a search about it, get facts and then maybe make an EDUCATED stab at this!

Last edited by Brenda; 03-15-2006 at 10:01 PM.
Old 03-15-2006, 10:44 PM
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AngieMose AngieMose is offline
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Kudos to Syele and Brenda! I couln't have said it better myself!

I have only one question for callowminx! Do you have children?
Angie Moseley
Child of God , wife to Keven , mommy to Marlie (14), Hannah (12), Dani (9) and Tyler (7) Deuteronomy 6:5-9
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